I never understand why these people try to parent other people’s kids.

That seems like an awful lot of work to get to some porn. Bit Torrents are way more effective.

Sean,

Well — there’s that. As a parent if you don’t know what your child is doing online it isn’t up to the government to figure that out for you. Tho, as history has shown, those who make the most noise about what ‘everybody else’ is doing tend to be the ones with very dark secrets to hide.

The GOP is going into the weeds this election cycle I predict. They all bought into Karl Rove’s ‘permanent majority’ nonsense and followed Bush/Cheney over they cliff and now they’re going to be hanging in the wind. I heard a news report yesterday I think which said that the RNC is telling its congressional delegation that they’re on their own in November. No money. No support. No nothing.

But this will be good for the country in a way. We’ve drifted too far to the right as it is; the nation tends to be self correcting on most occasions as history has shown. Huge losses for the Republicans in 2008 might actually force them to abandon the cultural conservative wing that’s basically hijacked the party. Tho the bigger issue this November will be judges.

nina

“Second Life was created for sickos like you who’ve managed to fuck up the life they were given the first time around.”

Uh, I’m a Ph. D. at a prestigious university. I use Second Life for research into artificial life and complex dynamics system

“Uh, I’m a Ph. D. at a prestigious university. I use Second Life for research into artificial life and complex dynamics system”

Yes, of course you do.

- nina aoki

btw: there’s no space between Ph. and D. — the correct way to abbreviate ‘Doctor of Philosophy’ or in Latin Philosophiæ Doctor is Ph.D. or sometimes PhD

They teach English at that prestigious university that’s got you spending your time playing with, err… “researching” Second Life? I mean, I’m just asking, okay?

Will Kirk’s legislation affect your school?

It’s nice to know “Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel” has now expanded to include the intertubes….

When you have nothing else in your record to run on …

Music today…
Claude Challe … The String Thing

Lazy Ichi, 博士号,

You know, I can’t quite figure out what motivates these people. I read another article here this morning about more proposed legislation; this one for video games. It’s insanity.

As a mother — I don’t need or want the government telling me how to parent my child.

The “enemy” is always something else; the internet, video games, pornography, condoms, whatever…

Oh! Well, my morning wake up music today is a combination of things. Frizzle Fry by Primus with some Smashing Pumpkins mixed in!

nina

Wow, Nina, what a thoroughly nasty person you can be.

I’ve included my academic email in the address field above. Feel free to email it to confirm my bona fides and my Ph.D. I’ll also put you in contact with the fairly famous scientific publication that sponsors and hosts my work if you want further confirmation.

I’ll even send you a copy of my most recent scholarly article, since you seem to be interested in proofreading me.

I’d prefer you not broadcast the email address to your “legions” of fans, though.

Ichi baby,

I settled on Star 69 by Fatboy Slim!

“Wow, Nina, what a thoroughly nasty person you can be.”

No, not really. I just respond to what I’m shown. If you really want to have a conversation about Second Life and the issues surrounding this, or anything I’ve written, I’m open to that.

But — when you show up here and use ‘Generalize Much?’ instead of something resembling a name or without any real measure of respect and think you can wave a Ph.D. in my face and think I’m just going to cave — well, that’s where you’re wrong.

And honestly hon? I’m not terribly interested in vetting your credentials either. If you think I generalized in my description of Second Life, well then, okay, fine. I can live with that. I did. But is that the point here?

While you may be the exception, and there are always exceptions aren’t there, I see real problems in people paying $9.95 a month to spend their lives pretending to be someone they’re not in some virtual landscape. The psychological implications of that are staggering.

While you may disagree with me, that’s fine too, but next time don’t wave your Ph.D. in my face, because you have absolutely no idea what my credentials may or may not be, kwim? And giving me your resume is not exactly a good way to start a conversation…

And really… I don’t have “legions of fans” who would be interested in knowing your email address either. Please. Do you want to have an adult conversation with me or not? So far it seems not.

nina

Do you want to have an adult conversation with me or not? So far it seems not.

Well, if it was the “generalize much?” label that hacked you off, I apologize for that. I’m as quick to irksomeness as many others (perhaps including yourself) and that was an ill chosen moniker.

But seriously, you end a very well put together argument with a slur like this:

Second Life was created for sickos like you who’ve managed to fuck up the life they were given the first time around.,

and it’s extremely off-putting, especially given that this is the kind of argument that was made against the internet around 94 or so. I’d expected better from a tech savvy person who has been in this medium for more than a little while.

As for not knowing your credentials, I didn’t see them as particularly relevant given that it wasn’t me who made the sweeping generalization about an entire class of people. I mentioned my occupation only to refute the slur you made above. You are construing an act of verbal self-defense as one of offense.

And with respect to having adult conversations, I can pretty much promise you that I won’t ever critique any punctuation errors you may make. A highish typing error rate is a particular problem for me, but I never considered it a hallmark of immaturity.

“Well, if it was the “generalize much?” label that hacked you off, I apologize for that. I’m as quick to irksomeness as it appears you may be and that was an ill chosen moniker.”

So you choose another one?

“And with respect to having adult conversations, I can pretty much promise you that I won’t ever critique any punctuation errors you may make. A highish typing error rate is a particular problem for me, but I never considered it a hallmark of immaturity.”

Sure — and my critique of your punctuation errors was about as significant and relevant as you telling me you had a Ph.D. — get it now?

I also wouldn’t characterize my response as “hacked off” either — you’re making assumptions about motivations without any evidence to support it. Tho, if you must know, it was amusement. I’ve often found that people who lead with their credentials to support their arguments usually don’t make very good ones. This is the real world (or as close to it as we get out here in cyberia) — not academia.

Tho I will say — I do have a hard time finding the motivation to have a conversation with someone who refuses to even give the pretense of identification — and a protracted battle of wits isn’t really why I do what I do either, kwim? It kind of bores me to be brutally honest with you.

But perhaps you should ask yourself this question: Why would someone who is a “tech savvy person who has been in this medium for more than a little while” make such a generalization in the first place?

The issue isn’t the generalization — it’s the motivation behind it that matters.

And if you choose to respond, please use a name next time. It’s incredibly insulting to everyone else here who participates in these conversations who has the courtesy to identify themselves in some manner. I consider it disrespectful to both them and me.

nina

So you choose another one?

Nina, if you didn’t see that as a climb down and one made entirely in good will, I don’t know what else I can say.

But perhaps you should ask yourself this question: Why would someone who is a “tech savvy person who has been in this medium for more than a little while” make such a generalization in the first place?

In my opinion, because she made an honest mistake. You haven’t convinced me otherwise, and I honestly don’t expect that you will, or even necessarily should.

I’m afraid I won’t do more to ID myself than I have above. It is somewhat obfuscated, but I’m more afraid of a tenure committee than I am of not getting another word in here. My continued employment and support of my family is my priority. I will understand if you don’t feel this meets the standard you’ve set.

Brandon,

It wouldn’t have mattered to me if you had called yourself “The Grand PooBah of the Internets” — it’s the implicit disrespect in leading with a characterization of behavior without the benefit of understanding the context instead of a more human identifier — and truly, this has drifted so far outside the context of what I wrote that I’m wondering exactly how to rope it back in — but I shall try.

You’ve taken issue with my use of the word “sicko” — okay, fine. That isn’t a mistake, it’s an opinion.

Linden Labs created the Second Life platform for what reason exactly? And what social benefit does that provide society? What have the damages been to the psyche of a large portion of the Second Life user base? I’ve often written about and discussed issues surrounding the internet, cyberia, and the sometimes damaging aspects of the various mediums on human psychology and behaviors. These are real issues; and the biggest problem with things like cyberia and things like Second Life is that it allows people to behave in a consequence free environment, which then essentially becomes a license for an unrestricted id (in the Freudian use of the word) to run unfettered.

In a discussion with a friend last night coincidentally, we discussed the dangers of simply accepting what we see online at face value but how we really have no other choice if we’re to participate in the medium.

Perhaps my indictment of why Second Life was created was a bit misplaced — perhaps what I could have said differently was Second Life has created a population of sickos — but in the context of what I was writing about, a Republican Congressman obsessed with virtual rape rooms on Second Life, it seemed to fit. And this was more a discussion about attempting to legislate parenting responsibility and personal freedoms — Second Life just happened to be the subject matter. Those issues are still wholly unanswered here.

I’m quite sure you’re well aware of the issues surrounding Second Life — even the title itself is psychologically dangerous. Human beings are frail fragile animals who have a hard enough time navigating the real world, nevermind a consequence free environment like Second Life.

But if you’ve got some kind of Westley Crusher thing going on with it, well, okay, that’s good then. I hope you’re able to keep that in perspective. I’m of the opinion that most cannot — and based on the latest data I’ve seen about how many hours some users spend behind the screen engaging in that environment, I don’t think I’m that far off base here.

And really Brandon, I don’t think the tenure committee is reading geishaland!

You need to relax!

nina

And really Brandon, I don’t think the tenure committee is reading geishaland!
You need to relax!

Google never forgets.

I’d be very happy to eliminate all the intervening posts and start with your last one…I ‘ve admitted my initial errors in approach. I wish I’d just come on and explained why I think the medium is cool. But the kind of generalization you proffered is one that I hear often enough in critiques of my simulation work that when it comes from someone who I actually think is quite intelligent, I get beside myself.

As for why Second Life was created, well, I’ve met Phillip Rosedale, the company’s founder, and he’s a bit of a cyber utopian. He was heavily influenced by NEil Stephenson’s Snow Crash and wanted to create a real “Metaverse”, to ultimately replace the 2D web with a 3D web, increasing the flexibility of content and interaction available to users. The extent to which this is truly going to happen, I cannot say, but I can say that for myself and my colleagues, SL provides a unique medium for teaching and research. I can construct a 3D virtual reality simulation of an island biosphere, program the animals, and let them go. People can login, observe, and learn about the interactions in the system and even experiment with modifying them. And I’m part of a fairly large network of educators and researchers who are each using simulators in similar ways to similar ends. I’d argue, actually, that that domain represents the majority and future of SL, not the freaks, psychos, and lunatics that seem to get the most press. As I noted, the internet was described similarly in its infancy. Perhaps a liberating, connective, electronic medium needs the weirdos and the scandal they generate to reach critical mass with the general public.

Ah, you’re probably sick of this, your audience probably is as well, so I’ll drop it. If you ever want a virtual tour of my work, and the great many cool and *sane* projects in SL, I’d be happy to give you a virtual tour. You have my email.

Brandon,

Google will be the downfall of us all!

You have been kind and gracious, thank you. Please allow me to respond in kind.

I completely understand how such a generalization would rattle your cage so to speak considering what appears to be a deeply invested commitment to using the platform as you’ve outlined — that’s completely within bounds, and let me add that my intention was not to offend. However, I hope you can appreciate the context from which I was writing from.

I also completely understand the concepts of creating a metaverse and what drives this from a creative perspective, as well as the “cool” factor — that I relate to on my own intimately personal levels. The variable however is always human beings, who often lack the maturity to co-exist with their own creations. I use the word maturity not from a common definition, but rather, maturity on an evolutionary scale, and in that respect, we’re quite child-like; still very much in our own infancy and subject to the vagaries of our own emotions and weaknesses. Sadly, this lack of human maturity is what so often perverts the very things which should be inspiring us to expand our humanity, not replace it as it has for so many.

All of these things sometimes move faster than we’re capable of digesting or understanding and making fit into our ‘real lives’ and what tends to happen is we substitute these things for anything resembling actual human interaction and growth.

Your project sounds compelling and fascinating and it’s encouraging to hear about something so cutting edge. Tho critical mass is often achieved without our ever realizing it — it’s how we adapt to that and learn which interests me.

Sadly, SL has received a share of bad press — rightfully so in some cases.

I explore topics in humanity here; from psychology to sexuality and how these things interrelate with each other. It’s disturbing on some levels to know what some people do with SL, but in another context, can’t we also argue that indulging those compulsions within a virtual environment is healthier and safer than actually doing it in the real world? Those are hard questions because we never get to the root of what drives those compulsions. I’m of course talking about virtual rape and some of the other extreme things which go on in a virtual consequence free environment.

Maybe someday humanity will grow up. But until then, I remain cautious but optimistic.

nina

Finally, the General has weighed in on this matter here.

Btw, your taste in music is, well, superb, as always!

Lazy Ichi,

That’s funny! And thank you! I pride myself on my diverse musical tastes!

nina